I have read through numerous pub car park ticket threads on the forums, however I have a slightly more unusual case here that I was interested in people's opinions on.

Basically my girlfriend had an agreement with a previous pub manager that she could park her car in the pub car park for a small fee every week, which she paid to the bar on a Sunday night for which she received a hand written ticket in return to display in her car. Recently the pub has been refurbished, during which time she parked elsewhere, but since opening again approx two/three months ago we visited the new manager who agreed that she could again park there and wrote out a ticket stating this and signed and dated it. He said at the time that there was no new system setup, however until the time something was organised she was ok to park there. She laminated this ticket and has had it displayed in her car everyday she parked there.

This week she has received a parking ticket from EFPN in Woking (A PO Box address - no contact number) issuing a £60 fine. After speaking with the pub manager who would not accept responsibility he put us in touch with the landlord who has been extremely unreasonable. His only input was that she was warned on numerous occasions by notes left on the car (no such notes have ever been issued, or have been removed prior to us seeing them and he claims he needs no evidence that this has taken place). His only other input was that we should write to EFPN in an attempt to dispute the ticket.

Above any other issue with such parking companies this all seems a little unreasonable due to the agreement with the manager originally. Can anyone offer some advice that we can base our dispute letter around to help bolster the appeal.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:26:53 +0100, bclark
wrote:
I have read through numerous pub car park ticket threads on the forums,
however I have a slightly more unusual case here that I was interested
in people's opinions on.

Basically my girlfriend had an agreement with a previous pub manager
that she could park her car in the pub car park for a small fee every
week, which she paid to the bar on a Sunday night for which she
received a hand written ticket in return to display in her car.
Recently the pub has been refurbished, during which time she parked
elsewhere, but since opening again approx two/three months ago we
visited the new manager who agreed that she could again park there and
wrote out a ticket stating this and signed and dated it. He said at the
time that there was no new system setup, however until the time
something was organised she was ok to park there. She laminated this
ticket and has had it displayed in her car everyday she parked there.

This week she has received a parking ticket from EFPN in Woking (A PO
Box address - no contact number) issuing a £60 fine. After speaking
with the pub manager who would not accept responsibility he put us in
touch with the landlord who has been extremely unreasonable. His only
input was that she was warned on numerous occasions by notes left on
the car (no such notes have ever been issued, or have been removed
prior to us seeing them and he claims he needs no evidence that this
has taken place). His only other input was that we should write to EFPN
in an attempt to dispute the ticket.

Above any other issue with such parking companies this all seems a
little unreasonable due to the agreement with the manager originally.
Can anyone offer some advice that we can base our dispute letter around
to help bolster the appeal.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

You don't have to respond at all. All your GF has received is an
unsubstantiated invoice claiming that she has agreed to the terms of
the contract by reading a warning sign and therefore must pay a
"parking charge". Despite the, no doubt, threatening nature of the
demand it does not constitute a fine or penalty. Nor do they have any
claim against the Registered Keeper as they may not have been driving
at the time. Whilst the courts can order a RK to disclose the name of
a driver at the time of an alleged traffic offence the same privelidge
is not granted to a private parking enforcement company.

There is no legal obligation to pay the invoice unless it is upheld in
the courts and a judgement issued. To date, AFAIK, no such judgement
has ever occured.

If you do feel compelled to write back, I would send a copy of the
ticket and a letter stating that their invoice is not valid and will
not be paid unless your GF is ordered to by the courts. I would also
suggest that any future correspondence or attempts to recover the
alleged debt would be futile, costly to the company and ignored by the
recipient.

Regards

Tom

Tom wrote:
On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:26:53 +0100, bclark
wrote:
I have read through numerous pub car park ticket threads on the forums,
however I have a slightly more unusual case here that I was interested
in people's opinions on.

Basically my girlfriend had an agreement with a previous pub manager
that she could park her car in the pub car park for a small fee every
week, which she paid to the bar on a Sunday night for which she
received a hand written ticket in return to display in her car.
Recently the pub has been refurbished, during which time she parked
elsewhere, but since opening again approx two/three months ago we
visited the new manager who agreed that she could again park there and
wrote out a ticket stating this and signed and dated it. He said at the
time that there was no new system setup, however until the time
something was organised she was ok to park there. She laminated this
ticket and has had it displayed in her car everyday she parked there.

This week she has received a parking ticket from EFPN in Woking (A PO
Box address - no contact number) issuing a £60 fine. After speaking
with the pub manager who would not accept responsibility he put us in
touch with the landlord who has been extremely unreasonable. His only
input was that she was warned on numerous occasions by notes left on
the car (no such notes have ever been issued, or have been removed
prior to us seeing them and he claims he needs no evidence that this
has taken place). His only other input was that we should write to EFPN
in an attempt to dispute the ticket.

Above any other issue with such parking companies this all seems a
little unreasonable due to the agreement with the manager originally.
Can anyone offer some advice that we can base our dispute letter around
to help bolster the appeal.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

You don't have to respond at all. All your GF has received is an
unsubstantiated invoice claiming that she has agreed to the terms of
the contract by reading a warning sign and therefore must pay a
"parking charge". Despite the, no doubt, threatening nature of the
demand it does not constitute a fine or penalty. Nor do they have any
claim against the Registered Keeper as they may not have been driving
at the time. Whilst the courts can order a RK to disclose the name of
a driver at the time of an alleged traffic offence the same privelidge
is not granted to a private parking enforcement company.

There is no legal obligation to pay the invoice unless it is upheld in
the courts and a judgement issued. To date, AFAIK, no such judgement
has ever occured.

If you do feel compelled to write back, I would send a copy of the
ticket and a letter stating that their invoice is not valid and will
not be paid unless your GF is ordered to by the courts. I would also
suggest that any future correspondence or attempts to recover the
alleged debt would be futile, costly to the company and ignored by the
recipient.

Regards

Tom

Is that the same as telling them to **** off?

"bclark" wrote in message
...

I have read through numerous pub car park ticket threads on the forums,
however I have a slightly more unusual case here that I was interested
in people's opinions on.

The usual advice, as you've probably discovered, is to ignore them.

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 20:28:49 +0100, Black Sheep wrote:

Tom wrote:
On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:26:53 +0100, bclark
wrote:
I have read through numerous pub car park ticket threads on the forums,
however I have a slightly more unusual case here that I was interested
in people's opinions on.

Basically my girlfriend had an agreement with a previous pub manager
that she could park her car in the pub car park for a small fee every
week, which she paid to the bar on a Sunday night for which she
received a hand written ticket in return to display in her car.
Recently the pub has been refurbished, during which time she parked
elsewhere, but since opening again approx two/three months ago we
visited the new manager who agreed that she could again park there and
wrote out a ticket stating this and signed and dated it. He said at the
time that there was no new system setup, however until the time
something was organised she was ok to park there. She laminated this
ticket and has had it displayed in her car everyday she parked there.

This week she has received a parking ticket from EFPN in Woking (A PO
Box address - no contact number) issuing a £60 fine. After speaking
with the pub manager who would not accept responsibility he put us in
touch with the landlord who has been extremely unreasonable. His only
input was that she was warned on numerous occasions by notes left on
the car (no such notes have ever been issued, or have been removed
prior to us seeing them and he claims he needs no evidence that this
has taken place). His only other input was that we should write to EFPN
in an attempt to dispute the ticket.

Above any other issue with such parking companies this all seems a
little unreasonable due to the agreement with the manager originally.
Can anyone offer some advice that we can base our dispute letter around
to help bolster the appeal.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

You don't have to respond at all. All your GF has received is an
unsubstantiated invoice claiming that she has agreed to the terms of
the contract by reading a warning sign and therefore must pay a
"parking charge". Despite the, no doubt, threatening nature of the
demand it does not constitute a fine or penalty. Nor do they have any
claim against the Registered Keeper as they may not have been driving
at the time. Whilst the courts can order a RK to disclose the name of
a driver at the time of an alleged traffic offence the same privelidge
is not granted to a private parking enforcement company.

There is no legal obligation to pay the invoice unless it is upheld in
the courts and a judgement issued. To date, AFAIK, no such judgement
has ever occured.

If you do feel compelled to write back, I would send a copy of the
ticket and a letter stating that their invoice is not valid and will
not be paid unless your GF is ordered to by the courts. I would also
suggest that any future correspondence or attempts to recover the
alleged debt would be futile, costly to the company and ignored by the
recipient.

...and regarded as harrasment, for which they will be reported to the Police.

Regards

Tom

Is that the same as telling them to **** off?

Except you don't even need to waste your time telling them. They will do so eventually by
themselves.

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:26:53 +0100, bclark
wrote:

snip


Above any other issue with such parking companies this all seems a
little unreasonable due to the agreement with the manager originally.
Can anyone offer some advice that we can base our dispute letter around
to help bolster the appeal.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

Don't bother.

Just ignore the ticket. It has no legal force.

If they try to sue for the money (which they won't), then they would
fail.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Meow... SPLAT... Ruff... SPLAT... (Raining cats & dogs)
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

On Jul 24, 12:25 pm, Alex Heney wrote:


Just ignore the ticket. It has no legal force.

If they try to sue for the money (which they won't), then they would
fail.

But ... If you do not pay, and you subsequently park in a lot
controlled by the same company, perhaps they may clamp or tow you
rather than give you another 'ticket'. And this may even be if you
comply with the rules with respect to the subsequent parking.

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 19:18:28 GMT, Tom wrote:

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:26:53 +0100, bclark
wrote:
I have read through numerous pub car park ticket threads on the forums,
however I have a slightly more unusual case here that I was interested
in people's opinions on.

Basically my girlfriend had an agreement with a previous pub manager
that she could park her car in the pub car park for a small fee every
week, which she paid to the bar on a Sunday night for which she
received a hand written ticket in return to display in her car.
Recently the pub has been refurbished, during which time she parked
elsewhere, but since opening again approx two/three months ago we
visited the new manager who agreed that she could again park there and
wrote out a ticket stating this and signed and dated it. He said at the
time that there was no new system setup, however until the time
something was organised she was ok to park there. She laminated this
ticket and has had it displayed in her car everyday she parked there.

This week she has received a parking ticket from EFPN in Woking (A PO
Box address - no contact number) issuing a £60 fine. After speaking
with the pub manager who would not accept responsibility he put us in
touch with the landlord who has been extremely unreasonable. His only
input was that she was warned on numerous occasions by notes left on
the car (no such notes have ever been issued, or have been removed
prior to us seeing them and he claims he needs no evidence that this
has taken place). His only other input was that we should write to EFPN
in an attempt to dispute the ticket.

Above any other issue with such parking companies this all seems a
little unreasonable due to the agreement with the manager originally.
Can anyone offer some advice that we can base our dispute letter around
to help bolster the appeal.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

You don't have to respond at all. All your GF has received is an
unsubstantiated invoice claiming that she has agreed to the terms of
the contract by reading a warning sign and therefore must pay a
"parking charge". Despite the, no doubt, threatening nature of the
demand it does not constitute a fine or penalty. Nor do they have any
claim against the Registered Keeper as they may not have been driving
at the time. Whilst the courts can order a RK to disclose the name of
a driver at the time of an alleged traffic offence the same privelidge
is not granted to a private parking enforcement company.

There is no legal obligation to pay the invoice unless it is upheld in
the courts and a judgement issued. To date, AFAIK, no such judgement
has ever occured.

If you do feel compelled to write back, I would send a copy of the
ticket and a letter stating that their invoice is not valid and will
not be paid unless your GF is ordered to by the courts. I would also
suggest that any future correspondence or attempts to recover the
alleged debt would be futile, costly to the company and ignored by the
recipient.

Regards

Tom

Excellent answer and what this newsgroup is all about, a pleasure to
read this response and the others too.

My faith has been restored in uk.legal ;-)

Dave

On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:19:30 -0700 (PDT), peterwn wrote:

On Jul 24, 12:25 pm, Alex Heney wrote:


Just ignore the ticket. It has no legal force.

If they try to sue for the money (which they won't), then they would
fail.

But ... If you do not pay, and you subsequently park in a lot
controlled by the same company, perhaps they may clamp or tow you
rather than give you another 'ticket'. And this may even be if you
comply with the rules with respect to the subsequent parking.

That would be illegal.

On Jul 24, 8:21 pm, Mike Harrison wrote:


But ... If you do not pay, and you subsequently park in a lot
controlled by the same company, perhaps they may clamp or tow you
rather than give you another 'ticket'. And this may even be if you
comply with the rules with respect to the subsequent parking.

That would be illegal.

Which aspect?

In any case what is the most practical thing to do if your vehicle is
clamped or towed - go and see a lawyer or just cough up.