Criminals serving Community Service will have to wear orange bibs,says Jack Straw

Criminals serving Community Service will have to wear orange bibs,
says Jack Straw

27/11/2008
Jack Straw
Community Payback

Offenders will be forced into orange uniforms when they carry out
community sentences from Monday.

In an exclusive interview, Justice Secretary Jack Straw revealed he is
making it compulsory to put wrong-doers into “vests of shame” from
next week.

He is pressing ahead despite fears Guantanamo-style outfits will
humiliate the wearers.

A total of 10,000 high- visibility tabards with “community payback”
emblazoned across the back have been ordered by the Ministry of
Justice.

The words are in purple and there will also be a “community payback”
logo on the front.

The uniforms will become a common sight as offenders wear them while
doing manual labour on Britain’s streets.

The vests have been made orange to make sure thugs cannot claim they
are construction or council workers who wear yellow outfits.

And Mr Straw told the Daily Mirror it was part of a shake-up to put
punishment back at the heart of the criminal justice system.

He said it was time to make it tougher for offenders.

Mr Straw said: “The whole purpose of this is to strengthen the
effectiveness of community punishments and improve the public’s
confidence in them.

“Community punishments are effective – often more effective than short
prison sentence.

“But some offenders think when they are given a community punishment
they are being let off.

“And the public can be forgiven for thinking the same thing. too.”

He added: “The public want to know the sentence is first and foremost
about punishment.”

Probation officers are expected to attack the move as demeaning to
offenders and dangerous as they could lead to attacks.

But Government Respect Tsar Louise Casey who has headed a major
inquiry into restoring public confidence in the criminal justice
system said it was time to make sentences tougher.

Sitting alongside Mr Straw, she said: “What is important is that
people who break the law face a consequence and that isn’t pleasant.

“The point of the orange jackets is not to humiliate people but to
make the punishment visible. We have got to be clear that if you wake
up in the morning, you go out and commit a criminal offence then you
are going to face a consequence.

“One of those consequences is that you will end up in an orange jacket
cleaning the streets in your community. From Monday that is the
message.’’ She added: “This is about making people accountable for the
offences they commit.

“The public want this to happen and it’s going to happen.”

Ms Casey added that as well as pushing offenders it would also deter
other youngsters from carrying out crimes. She tells a story of how in
a trial scheme in Birmingham, offenders were made to clean toilets in
a community centre.

“One of the kids said ‘The last thing I want to do is clean those
toilets. I think I’ll steer clear of trouble. This is why visibility
is so important.”

Mr Straw has acknowledged it had been a tough battle to bring in the
new uniforms with the Probation Service warning they would be the
modern equivalent of chain gangs.

Former Home Secretary Charles Clarke had to do an embarrassing U-turn
when he first suggested the plan in 2005. And critics claimed it would
mean offenders being humiliated in orange Guantanamo Bay-style boiler
suits.

But Mr Straw said it was important probation officers who supervise
criminals when they carry out community sentences toughen up.

He said: “Some parts of the Probation Service have frankly lost their
way over the years.

“It is really important they get it back. Otherwise the public
pressure for more and more offenders to go to prison will increase. It
is very important for the Probation Service and the future of the
Probation Service.

“It is vital that given the very large sums of money spent on the
Probation Service that the Probation Service better connect with the
public.”

He added: “There has been a lot of anxiety about humiliation.

“But the crucial thing is this – people who become offenders humiliate
themselves.” Ms Casey added: “We have to be clear when we punish
people. That means we can be clear we are spending money and time
making sure they don’t do it again.”

Ministers are also thinking about getting people to nominate “grot
spots” which need cleaning up.

Ms Casey people should be able to phone up a special telephone line or
nominate at public meetings areas they wanted cleaned up. The public
must see consequences for people committing offences.” Mr Straw also
said reforming community sentences would have a big impact on jail
overcrowding.

He said: “Magistrates will tell you they send people to prison out of
frustration that offenders have not got the message after a number of
chances with community sentences.

“The more effective we can make community sentences then the fewer
people will need to be sent to prison.”

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-sto...5875-20929997/

***

“The more effective we can make community sentences then the fewer
people will need to be sent to prison.”

You idiot, Straw ...to think this is, in any way, 'effective'.

WM
www.critest.com

Webmanager_CritEst wrote:



Ms Casey added that as well as pushing offenders it would also deter
other youngsters from carrying out crimes. She tells a story of how in
a trial scheme in Birmingham, offenders were made to clean toilets in
a community centre.

“One of the kids said ‘The last thing I want to do is clean those
toilets. I think I’ll steer clear of trouble.


Highly offensive to people who do an honest days w*rk cleaning toilets
for a living I'd say.

On 28 Nov, 15:43, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:


“The more effective we can make community sentences then the fewer
people will need to be sent to prison.”

You idiot, Straw ...to think this is, in any way, 'effective'.

WMwww.critest.com

------------------------------------------

I disagree. Experience in USA shows that "public shaming" of non-
violent offenders is highly effective. Straw is on the right track,
but too hesitant. Hard work and being humiliated in front of their
peers is what many young people fear the most. But then perhaps if
given the choice by the court of doing some work in public or going to
jail, many will choose jail.....

On Nov 28, 3:54*pm, Special Care
wrote:
On 28 Nov, 15:43, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:



“The more effective we can make community sentences then the fewer
people will need to be sent to prison.”

You idiot, Straw ...to think this is, in any way, 'effective'.

WMwww.critest.com

------------------------------------------

I disagree. Experience in USA shows that "public shaming" of non-
violent offenders is highly effective. Straw is on the right track,
but too hesitant. Hard work and being humiliated in front of their
peers is what many young people fear the most. But then perhaps if
given the choice by the court of doing some work in public or going to
jail, many will choose jail.....

Evidence?

WM

On Nov 28, 4:05*pm, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:
On Nov 28, 3:54*pm, Special Care
wrote:





On 28 Nov, 15:43, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:

“The more effective we can make community sentences then the fewer
people will need to be sent to prison.”

You idiot, Straw ...to think this is, in any way, 'effective'.

WMwww.critest.com

------------------------------------------

I disagree. Experience in USA shows that "public shaming" of non-
violent offenders is highly effective. Straw is on the right track,
but too hesitant. Hard work and being humiliated in front of their
peers is what many young people fear the most. But then perhaps if
given the choice by the court of doing some work in public or going to
jail, many will choose jail.....

Evidence?

WM- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

---------

I didn't keep a record of the news reports from USA.
I think we know that young people greatly fear 'losing face' in front
of their peers and also greatly fear manual labour.

On Nov 28, 4:09*pm, Special Care
wrote:
On Nov 28, 4:05*pm, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:



On Nov 28, 3:54*pm, Special Care
wrote:

On 28 Nov, 15:43, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:

“The more effective we can make community sentences then the fewer
people will need to be sent to prison.”

You idiot, Straw ...to think this is, in any way, 'effective'.

WMwww.critest.com

------------------------------------------

I disagree. Experience in USA shows that "public shaming" of non-
violent offenders is highly effective. Straw is on the right track,
but too hesitant. Hard work and being humiliated in front of their
peers is what many young people fear the most. But then perhaps if
given the choice by the court of doing some work in public or going to
jail, many will choose jail.....

Evidence?

WM- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

---------

I didn't keep a record of the news reports from USA.
I think we know that young people greatly fear 'losing face' in front
of their peers and also greatly fear manual labour.

See my response in the other thread.

Most of these lads have been humiliated all their lives.

It will end in tears.

WM

On Nov 28, 3:53*pm, Terry Harris wrote:
Webmanager_CritEst wrote:

Ms Casey added that as well as pushing offenders it would also deter
other youngsters from carrying out crimes. She tells a story of how in
a trial scheme in Birmingham, offenders were made to clean toilets in
a community centre.

“One of the kids said ‘The last thing I want to do is clean those
toilets. I think I’ll steer clear of trouble.

Highly offensive to people who do an honest days w*rk cleaning toilets
for a living I'd say.

Indeed.

Not only that, but I can imagine what will happen, in Donny, when the
orange-clad lads' mates (and their enemies), start their public,
'naming and shaming' on the High Street.

WM

There's a lot of debate about "public shaming." I remember reading a
couple of favourable reports on it from USA, but I don't know what the
ultimate answer is.
http://www.restorativejustice.org/ed...feb08/saruling

On Nov 28, 4:23*pm, Special Care
wrote:
There's a lot of debate about "public shaming." I remember reading a
couple of favourable reports on it from USA, but I don't know what the
ultimate answer is.http://www.restorativejustice.org/ed...feb08/saruling

I am all for restorative justice, but that does not include the
humiliation of anyone.

WM

On Nov 28, 4:25*pm, Webmanager_CritEst wrote:
On Nov 28, 4:23*pm, Special Care
wrote:

There's a lot of debate about "public shaming." I remember reading a
couple of favourable reports on it from USA, but I don't know what the
ultimate answer is.http://www.restorativejustice.org/ed...feb08/saruling

I am all for restorative justice, but that does not include the
humiliation of anyone.

WM

----------------

Is telling the truth about someone "humiliation." Is it wrong to tell
the truth about someone? Or to impose on them the requirement that
they display a placard telling the truth about themselves?