I am interested in finding out what sort of crimes might receive a given
financial penalty (for an individual). Similarly I am interested in
knowing what level of damages would be awarded for the same financial
penalty.

The figures I have in mind a
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000

I realise that this isn't a precise science. I have looked at the
sentencing guidelines but generally the scope is so wide as to be pretty
useless. Consequently, if any contributors could give specific examples
of where fines/damages at those levels have been imposed together with
the circumstances I would be very grateful.

Thanks.

Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no sensible answer, I
am afraid.

On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:
Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no sensible answer, I
am afraid.

Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.

"Doctor Dave" wrote in message
...
On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:
Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no
sensible answer, I
am afraid.

Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Damages are based upon cost. So a "crime" that resulted in having to pay
10,000 pounds damages would be one that created 10,000 pounds of damage.

Is this clear?

tim

On 26 Aug, 21:30, "tim....." wrote:
"Doctor Dave" wrote in message

...
On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:

Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no
sensible answer, I
am afraid.

Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------

Damages are based upon cost. So a "crime" that resulted in having to pay
10,000 pounds damages would be one that created 10,000 pounds of damage.

Is this clear?

tim

It is not clear and in fact cannot be clear because it is incorrect.
There are many instances when damages are payable when there hasn't
been a direct cost. In those cases an assessment has to be made of
the 'value' of the damages in the absence of any objective or direct
measurement.

It is also the case that damages can be payable in the absence of any
crime.

On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 20:35:04 +0100, Doctor Dave
wrote:

On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:
Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no sensible answer, I
am afraid.

Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

That depends very much on the severity of the particular crime plus
the income of the offender.

The sentencing guidelines are as precise as you will get.


What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?


Damages are awarded in general to put the claimant in the position he
would have been in the if the wrong complained of had not occurred.

So if it would cost £10,000 to put right whatever wrong was done, then
the damages will be £10,000. These can be reduced if the claimant has
not done all he reasonably can to mitigate his losses.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
If you can't debug it, deplug it.
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:15:06 +0100, Doctor Dave
wrote:

On 26 Aug, 21:30, "tim....." wrote:
"Doctor Dave" wrote in message

...
On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:

Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no
sensible answer, I
am afraid.

Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------

Damages are based upon cost. So a "crime" that resulted in having to pay
10,000 pounds damages would be one that created 10,000 pounds of damage.

Is this clear?

tim

It is not clear and in fact cannot be clear because it is incorrect.

He was 100% correct.

There are many instances when damages are payable when there hasn't
been a direct cost. In those cases an assessment has to be made of
the 'value' of the damages in the absence of any objective or direct
measurement.


True, but that doesn't invalidate the point. It just means that in
some cases, the cost of the damage has to be estimated.


It is also the case that damages can be payable in the absence of any
crime.

Indeed, a very large majority of damages are paid when there has been
no crime. Which is why he put "crime" in quotation marks above.

I'm sorry, but your questions really don't have much that can be
meaningfully answered.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Don't look at me in that tone of voice!
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

Alex Heney wrote:
On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:15:06 +0100, Doctor Dave
wrote:

On 26 Aug, 21:30, "tim....." wrote:
"Doctor Dave" wrote in message

...
On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:

Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no
sensible answer, I
am afraid.
Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------

Damages are based upon cost. So a "crime" that resulted in having to pay
10,000 pounds damages would be one that created 10,000 pounds of damage.

Is this clear?

tim
It is not clear and in fact cannot be clear because it is incorrect.

He was 100% correct.

He certainly wasn't. At best it was a partial answer. Damages are
based on an assessment of value. In many cases there is no tangible
cost. In those cases where there is a cost then the damages will be
based on that.

Doctor Dave wrote:
On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:
Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no sensible answer, I
am afraid.

Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.


I'm hoping for some specific examples here that people might be aware of
rather than generalities.

For example:
- somebody was guilty of offence X, the mitigating circumstances were Y
and the fine was £10,000.
- somebody did (non-criminal act) V (which did not result in a financial
loss to the person on the receiving end) and for which damages were
assessed at £15,000 because of mitigating circumstances W.

It seems to me that in the criminal element of this, those fines are
very high and consequently I would expect them to be imposed for serious
offences.

Thanks.

On Wed, 27 Aug 2008 07:45:08 +0100, Dave wrote:

Alex Heney wrote:
On Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:15:06 +0100, Doctor Dave
wrote:

On 26 Aug, 21:30, "tim....." wrote:
"Doctor Dave" wrote in message

...
On 26 Aug, 20:10, Bystander wrote:

Damages are a civil matter . Fines are criminal. Your question has no
sensible answer, I
am afraid.
Yes it does but maybe it would be clearer to separate the two
questions.

What crimes might attract penalties of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

What damages (unrelated to the crimes above) might attract awards of:
- £10,000
- £15,000
- £20,000?

Hope this is clearer.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------

Damages are based upon cost. So a "crime" that resulted in having to pay
10,000 pounds damages would be one that created 10,000 pounds of damage.

Is this clear?

tim
It is not clear and in fact cannot be clear because it is incorrect.

He was 100% correct.

He certainly wasn't.

Yes he was.

If you think otherwise, then you clearly have not understood what you
yourself have then written.

At best it was a partial answer. Damages are
based on an assessment of value. In many cases there is no tangible
cost. In those cases where there is a cost then the damages will be
based on that.

None of this is in any way contradicting what he said.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
To err is human. To blame someone else is politics.
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom